Any money achieved trough intelligence and legal means is valid, just because it wasn’t made by swinging a hammer arund doesn’t mean is not hard work.

“A small government is no different. Japan was ruled by an emperor, and Germany by the Nazis! Caesar, Napoleon, Alexander the Great, all conquerors, all tyrants. Historically your argument doesn’t hold up.”

I don’t understand this piece, do you think the NAZIS wanted small government? that’s completely absurd.

“in this case it was stealing from the poor to give to the rich or what is known as bailouts.”

Blatantly not true. The US Federal Reserve isn’t even a deposit of currency, since all of the money is on loan, mostly from China. Also, Obama’s new tax plans require taxing the rich more heavily, so if it’s going to be paid back, the rich will do it. What of the unfair tax policies that have plagued the “middle” class for decades?

“all the criticisms of how this system is not working is really a criticism of how big government doesn’t work.”

That’s incredibly generalized. What of the other large nations in the world who were doing just fine until the crisis? Also, how do you define “big?” Economically? By population?

“In an actual free market, hard work and savings is what makes people wealthy.”

And you say this in the light of how many financial company bonuses?

“We don’t want to do any real work, we just want to complain about how hard we are working and how the “man” is keeping us down!”

Anybody who has actually read Marx will realize this is exactly the OPPOSITE of what he proposes. Rather, with all these hedge funds, pyramid schemes and investments in our modern market, this quote applies more to American capitalism. Just two weeks ago John Stewart was criticizing Jim Cramer for CBS’s shows that do exactly that- encouraging people to make fast money in unrealistic schemes.

“I have not read the book but, I am aware of it.”

Then you have no right to discuss it. The rest of that bit is gibberish; you have no idea what you’re talking about. Nobody says the market is random, firstly- but how many people predicted this recession and did something about it? That’s just stupidity.

“Apparently people have a “right” to a house and a “right” to health care but, a person who works hard and saves has no “right” to his own money!”

The entire point is that this person has NOT worked for that money! You call inheriting a fortune hard work? You call exploiting women or junkies hard work?

“That is even more appalling to free people. It is certainly not unexpected for a Marxist to want to enslave everyone. That is the only way the Marxian utopia can be founded: by force.”

How do you even get to this conclusion? I can debate freedom for days, but suffice it to say a person has no right or reason to destroy others’ lives just for what he thinks is freedom.

“Every choice has its consequences and it is our responsibility to deal with them.”

Out of context. The point of that whole bit was to say that you don’t stab after you think about it for two seconds.

“The choice here is to let people live peacefully in “ignorance” or allow one group to enslave another without the other knowing it or consenting to it.”

Limiting yourself to two options only shows your narrow-mindedness and lack of imagination. Educating these masses, for example, is a different solution. Simply ensuring they do not perish meaninglessly would guarantee a workforce; even for the worst capitalist pig, that’s an appealing concept.

“Marx didn’t have all this economic understanding wrong…Wealth can only be created through production and savings–absolutely correct.”

WRONG. In so many ways. If you read through it again you’d realize the error I proposed wasn’t economic- it was sociological, psychological, perhaps even egotistic in his judgment of human character. Also, savings is not necessarily wealth, just look at the variable values of currency in the global economy. A person can easily speculate on the future of the economy, transfer his funds into a different currency, and amass a fortune for doing no work at all.

“If men are evil, the last thing we need is a big government.”

A small government is no different. Japan was ruled by an emperor, and Germany by the Nazis! Caesar, Napoleon, Alexander the Great, all conquerors, all tyrants. Historically your argument doesn’t hold up.

“There is no system where you can avoid having someone unqualified to rule everyone else.”

Firstly, the point was that an uneducated man is unqualified to even cast a vote, not that the leader is unqualified. Secondly, there are systems that theoretically allow a qualified leader to rule- read some Plato.

You sound like you would reach the same conclusions I have- some of your ideas are my opinions as well. However, you seriously need to educate yourself. Your very method of debate is like listening to a priest in church- all fluff and declarations, with no solid fact to serve as evidence. It is very easy to say that the proverbial “they” want the public to think a certain thing. It is not easy to convince anyone without any proof.